The End is Nigh for Warhammer Online

Well, goodbye WAR. EA doesn't have a good curriculum when it comes to unsuccessful MMOs.

 

I just downloaded the 10-day trial. I wasn't very impressed. No internal v-sync or AA support? I tried a Witch Hunter to Level 3, but just got bored with it really quick. I think that WoW just wore out the MMORPG genre for me. The whole combat system just feels played out.

 

Both Conan and Warhammer are set to collapse, LotR seems to be struggling, and we've heard nothing on Guild Wars 2. Who knows what'll become of Darkfall and Final Fantasy XI. Only WoW, EvE and the original Guild Wars still seem to be trundling on happily.
 
Honestly developers, just give it up. We don't need MORE MMO's. We need BETTER games. I know what armando means about being worn out; spending hours upon hours building up a character in one MMO, then starting a character from scratch in a new MMO.... most people are like "Oh god, this all over again?" Doesn't matter how different or visually impressive or amazing the character development is. It still FEELS like you're doing the same thing all over again.

It's not even the character build up that's fun; the good part is when you finally get strong enough to take on the more powerful creatures and collect the loot. Who wants to waste another 40-60 hours getting to that point?

 

Good elaboration. I'd like to stress that combat WILL need to be improved in the next successful MMORPG. People are sick and tired of the same old combat. If they aren't, then they are content in their game as it is now (WoW, FFXI, or what have you) and don't really need another clone. I want to see an MMO with skill-based combat. Guild Wars was supposed to provide this, but in my mind it was not fully developed. Developers need take a step back and look at successful multiplayer games, such as TF2, COD4, L4D, etc. for some guidance. I'd happily play a MMO that had the fun combat system in Oblivion. Come on devs!

 

Well, City of Heroes/Villiains is still doing pretty good, especially with the player generated missions in the next major update.

And there's a few superhero themed MMOs coming DC Universe online and Champions Online, which both offer an actioned-up combat system.

Look futher than the mainstream MMOs, there might even be somtehing...

 

So many amazing ideas that were poorly implemented

 

Amen to that! (to what Project_xii said)

 

Far be it from me to be the voice of dissention around here, but...

Warhammer Online fills a niche, a niche that a lot of folks are all too eager to fall into. 300,000 subscribers is by no means a failure, god damnit. This isn't the first time I've seen someone say that. People look at WoW's 4.5 million (America & Europe combined) subscribers and gawk, but there's a little thing that folks don't realize, there; WoW is not the norm. Beyond that, WoW is not a game; it's become a sort of social phenomenon. A lot of folks don't play the game because it's good, they play it because it's WoW: The Gateway Drug to the world of MMOs. Easy to pick up, easy to play. That's not true for everyone, seeing as there are a lot of people who have been here since the start playing it as well, but it's true enough to be a prevalent factor. Looking towards Warhammer, falling from 750,000 isn't something that I'm shocked about. In fact, 200-300,000 is the number that I can be quoted somewhere as saying before the thing even came out, as far as how many people were going to settle in for the longer haul. You have a crapload of people that will A) try it for a month to see if it's their style, B) are wanting to play something until the Wrath of the Lich King is released, C) See it on a store shelf and think, hey, that looks neat, or any number of things. In the case of B, most were going to leave now matter HOW good WAR was; it could have given out free cookies and handjobs, and they'd still run back to Blizzard's teat when they called them home for dinner.

You can always pick the core fans out of the crowd, and they sure as hell are not going anywhere any time soon. They're there because it's Warhammer, and because they are having fun (or are masochists, but either way, they're there because they want to be). They fight for fighting's sake, and I say, more power to them.

Regarding WoW, I'm not exactly an avid fan. This is coming from someone who actually did play the game for upwards of two years, back when it came out, and intermittantly in between when friends returned to it for a few months to check out the new content. I tend to only play MMOs with people I know in RL at this point, sans LotRO, which I play on the side regardless for some reason. It's fun. I also play EverQuest 2 with some friends of mine, and anyone who has anything negative to say about that gets an extra special middle finger from me.

I have my own thoughts, opinions and preferences, just like anyone else, and while I try to think of and present things logically, sometimes a bit of that personal preference butts in there, and is definitely rearing its head right here... kind of unprofessional, but I suppose that's the crux of the thing, really. Perspective and preference. Despite its flaws, I am not whatsoever ashamed to say that I like Warhammer Online. I like the world, I like the look, I like lots of little things. Despite its initial appearance, it's actually a vastly different game than World of WarCraft in both style and execution, and that's why I like it as much as I do. And before you say "Hur hur, lack of polish, WoW clone, etc etc etc", I'ma make one thing crystal clear: If you head into Warhammer Online expecting to be treated to a WoW-like experience and saying its PvE sucks because it doesn't quite live up to it, well, you're going to be sorely disappointed and you aren't getting into it for the right reasons. Strictly speaking from a PvE standpoint, WoW trumps the game hands-down. It's had years to polish and release expansions, and their engine tech's moved up to the point that they can actually make a lot of neat effects for quests and such... but that's off-topic.

It's similar, yes, but ... at the same time, completely different. Before you start crying, "Hur hur, WAR fanboi, hur hur", the reason why I'm saying all of this is due to the fact that Warhammer Online isn't about fighting bigger and tougher mobs, it isn't about collecting better and better loot (though you can), and it isn't about fighting against some half-baked plot device for the next ten levels of content (though it has a few of those, too):

It's about F'ing. Breaking. Peoples'. Skulls. Repeatedly. It's a persistent world where you can fight against other players, with reasonable effectiveness, from the very beginning; right up from level one, all the way to level 40. Assuming, of course, you play the game in its intended form and stick to a Core server; if you go to an Open server, you kinda get a shoddily implemented grief-fest... but that's an issue for another post. No, the game isn't 'perfect'. No game is, nor will it ever be, because in the end it is still something not created by divine hands. No, WAR isn't particularly innovative... but its mechanics are solid (rogue bugs notwithstanding), and it's easy to slide into.

A bigger issue here is, god f'ing damnit, where the hell do people have FUN anymore? Everyone these days seems pissed off to the tenth degree, and are always complaining about -everything-, be it an improvement to an existing game or a new game that's coming out... and I question whether the majority of folks can even see the forest for the trees, anymore. It's always doom or gloom, and in some cases, it's much-warranted (Flagship Studios, anyone?)... but Mythic is going above and beyond to try to get the thing patched up and keep the fans happy. I can respect your (not pointing names or naming fingers) feelings if you just don't like the thing, but don't wish doom upon it just because it doesn't fit your style. That's childish. Of course, I won't think less of you if that's just the way you are. No, that's a lie.

A couple of bullet points before I wrap up my rambling:

- The Server Closure is something that was expected from the very start by a lot of fans. They opened a ton of them to accomodate the aforementioned massive influx of players that would ultiamtely leave in favor of X, Y or Z, and because of the fact that they didn't think that their hardware could handle as many players as it actually could. Subsequently, it's something that has been asked for repeatedly by avid players of the game, so that fighting would be a lot easier to run into in both Scenarios and Open RVR zones.
- If you only played a Witch Hunter to level 3, you aren't really seeing... anything. Before you tell me to zog off, let me tell you that when I first started playing the game, I literally felt sick on my stomach thanks to being a WoW vet. It just felt WAY too familiar... but the more that I played it, the broader the difference between the two became. The strictly PvE aspect of the game is boring as hell, so if that's what you're there for, then you should probably stick with your original assessment... but definitely try out some of the scenarios if you are looking for some player action, since Bolster will kick your effective level up to 8 as long as you're there. Run with a group, and don't try to be a solo hero right out of the gate - you will get eaten alive, but as time progresses (especially as a Witch Hunter, who does SICK single-target damage after a short while) you can do a lot of sick things to folks that won't expect it. The game is massively situational.

I'll be honest, I too would LOVE to see some innovation. I'd love to see an MMO with real-time combat like something you'd see in Devil May Cry, Star Ocean or the somewhat more deliberately-paced Monster Hunter, but that's just not something that we're going to get in the immediate future. When we do, though, I'll probably be all over it... but until then, I'll just keep liking and playing the things that I do.

So that's my two zenny, I suppose. I honestly don't think that Warhammer Online is going ANYWHERE; even DDO is still around and updating, and they only have a tiny fraction of folks compared to WAR's subscriberbase. If it does, feel free to laugh and point out how stupid I was for foolishly enjoying something ... just be aware that my response, as it always has been and always will be, shall consist of:

**** you.

 

Excellent counter-points, if a little verbose, Keffy. To all the perpetually pessimistic out there, don't let the length of Keffy's post scare you. Read something longer than a google search summary for a change .

 

Sums up my thoughts exactly...

Especially this whole "everything sucks!" trend. Everywhere, on every forum for every game - any place anyone can say something about a game these days, it seems it is negative.

I think some games deserve it - but alot absolutely do not, and there is some really great stuff out there to enjoy. Nothing is perfect, never will be.

So to me, there is just ONE question that you must answer about a game - no other question or issue -really- matters:

Is it fun?

Because that is the ONLY reason you are spending your time doing this. It serves no other purpose. If it is - play it! Screw what anyone else thinks. If it isn't, for god sakes man, stop!

End.

 

True they eff'ed up, but really, their (possible?) eminent demise has something to do with the economy. Most of my friends that had game and film industry jobs are now pacing the streets looking for new gigs, and they were working at companies that did nothing wrong. Hell, The Orphanage, who did SFX for films such as Iron Man and The Host closed it's doors a few months ago, releasing over 400 specialists and support staff (a few of them friends of mine) out into the dark. So in my very biased, but honest opinion, I really don't think that the issues Mythic is having and the current state of the economy can be completely unrelated.

Oh, and to Keffy, my gateway drug was Guild Wars... remember, the first time's free....

 

Well sometimes the suits who carry the moneybags tend to **** up with the company's finances and investments and it has nothing to do with the performance of the company itself. With regards to Mythic, I'm pretty sure it's everything to do with the reception of the game and little else. The game itself isn't bad per se, but the ideas were all uniformly poorly executed.

 

...And yet they still have 300,000 active subscribers. That's not poor reception in the slightest - that's a crapton of people.

I'm also somewhat annoyed by the idea that everyone is trying to "Copy WoW". Sure they were the most successful kid on the block... but they were certainly not the first. It's inspired many, true, but new MMOs would come into being whether WoW was there or not. Everyone accuses people of "Copying WoW", but seem to neglect the fact that WoW kind of copied everyone else, when it first came out. Mechanics aside, the entire game is one gigantic amalgamation of tributes to popular culture. Speaking purely of mechanics, they brought in a lot of things from existing MMOs, and came up with a few more.

Those worked out well, so they were then used as groundwork for other folks' work. Different, non-WoW games come out with things that Blizzard didn't think of, and before you know it, those things are in WoW too. It's just the way that progression works. General people and fanbois alike give WoW the cred because they're the 500 lb tomcat prancing around on the roof, but they're just as guilty as everyone else. That kind of impact tends to leave an impact, as it were, and there you have the industry as it stands. But I digress.

Though I'm curious, how long did you play WAR, Sol? Were you Core or Open? What made you fed up with it?

 

That number also includes people who subscribed for 3-6 months. They are not necessarily playing the game, still.

Everyone tries to copy WOW, which copied the good aspects of the games before it (especially EQ), because it's a successful, tried and true formula. It hardly matters that Everquest and Asheron's Call came first. None of them made the mark WOW did, so for all intents and purposes, most games these days that try to stake out territory in the MMO market are WOW clones.

I played WAR for a month and a half and I played on a Core server because Open ones were simply too unruly with high ranked players ganking low ranked ones in the earlier tiers. Supposedly, the game was more exciting, but I'd never equate that kind of frustration to excitement.

 

Unfortunately, I think it's going to be another few years before we see an MMO that is worth it's weight, and capable of even holding a flame to WoW's success; After Mythic, Funcom and others saw how incredibly successful WoW has been for Blizzard, they all jumped on the MMO train (yes I know Warhammer MMO had been in pre-production stage for a while, but nothing was initiated really until post-WoW release), but now that other companies have seen just how hit-and-miss MMO's can be, we'll see developers take their time to truly perfect their games, as opposed to shelving them as soon as humanly possible (which I really do hope happens; Blizzard's gotten far too comfortable with their borderline-monopoly on the market, which has lead to slower releases of new content, and overall less content to boot).

One thing I have noticed that is different than WoW that all of these other games have in common; I have no idea what their plot is. WoW thrived on already having a cult following of huge fans of their RTS series, which was rich in lore of itself. The story and the intricacies of the world may seem trivial at first, but honestly I think that's what a lot of these games are lacking; immersion.

 

Blizzard was known for two things before WoW came out, polishing a game before they released it, and having a decent storyline.  I can't say the first was true when WoW came out, but the fact that there was a discernible plot line and stayed true to enough of the past games was what drew me into it in the first place. 

WoW's appeal is more than Blizzard's ability to pick apart the better ideas in the industry and apply them, and (storyline not withstanding) it's more than polish on the games.  They don't take themselves too seriously, there are little pop-culture references everywhere, and that means their playerbase can feel more at home in the game world than they normally would.  It breaks the monotony of grinding out a character when you can laugh at some 10 year old reference to a bad TV show and then get back to whatever you were doing, instead of keeping things so serious that you may as well be LARPing a D&D game.

 

I'm happy I never picked this game up! It just looked like WOW to me, and as you know I dropped WOW before my 10 days were up.

 

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